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November 15, 2012

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Rasta

What a stupid and snide post. And this is ALL you have to say about the ongoing horrific onslaught on the children, womena and men of Gaza? Nice one.
PS I happen to be in contact with quite a few people in Gaza who, whether or not they may call themselves anarchists, are sympathetic to anarchist principles and to anarchists (being that anarchists are one of the few groups in 'israeli' society who have offered any serious support to the Palestinian struggle and serious opposition to the zionist state). They may not be fans of Hamas and they may have gotten beaten up and arrested by Hamas police, but they are unanimous in seeing their main number one enemy as I-S-R-A-E-L, since they do live in the place called reality, where having white phosphorus dropped on your kids while you are all trapped with nowhere to run, is just slightly more objectionable than being hit with a stick by some uniformed thug like any other uniformed thug anywhere in the world.
There are two ends of UK activism on this issue that I can't stand, one is the bulging-eyed ranting conspiracy freaks spouting their nonsense about reptilian jews from outer space controlling us all from hitler's secret base in antarctica, represented by someone whose name I won't mention, and the other end is represented by you - purveyors of snide mealy mouthed crap who can't offer a basic gesture of solidarity to a desperately oppressed people because they don't all meet all your ideological guidelines (which most of em have never heard of so how are they supposed to meet em?)

romanticanarchist

Gerald Kaufmann former Labour foreign minister was out of government and in opposition during the last main bombing of Gaza in 2008 when 1500 people were killed and over 5,000 injured. “A gang of thugs led by war criminals” Kaufman called the Israeli cabinet from the parliamentary back benches. He would never have used such language or even criticism when in office. In office, he was an essential part of the killing machine, at that time in Iraq, just as William Hague, Susan Rice, British “even-handed” media et al are at the moment part of the killing machine in Gaza —and Syria.

Independent UK reporter Harry Fear is providing live stream news from a Gaza hotel on the war. He is a real example of journalistic integrity, an actual war reporter, unlike any whatsoever of the corporates on the Palestinian situation. Israel banned foreign journalists from entering Gaza earlier this week - the usual accompaniment to an escalation of their violence.

Rasta

Just heard from Harry Fear that 2 media workers have just been killed in Gaza by the second israeli airstrike on the media building in as many days. The death toll is now rapidly approaching 100, overwhelmingly civilians and including over 20 children so far, with hundreds more severely injured who may join those figures at any moment. check Harry's live stream here... intermittent because internet is intermittent in Gaza http://www.ustream.tv/channel/operation-pillar-of-cloud
This is a Nazi-style blitzkrieg massacre beyond a shadow of a doubt. The US/UK-sponsored Zio-Nazi colonial settler apartheid terror state's days are numbered.

Paul Stott

Rasta - I have been writing, critically, about Islamo-Anarchism for years, and will continue to do so. Intellectually I regard the concept as nonsense - it is a bit like trying to be a Catholic Orangeman. But I have seen it done well - the Steampunk Sharia site is at least run by someone with a head on his shoulders - and badly. The tweet I blogged about is an example of it being done badly - the politics of Kevin the Teenager writ large.

(To see the Steampunk Sharia site follow the link below)

http://www.steampunkshariah.info/

On Gaza, I was delighted to see the Head of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades killed by the IDF. The society he and Hamas are creating in Gaza (and will soon no doubt create in a Palestinian state) is one without basic freedoms.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/30/women-gaza-life-changed

The tragedy is the civilian deaths, in both Gaza and Israel. The best way for that to stop is for Hamas to stop firing rockets at Israeli civilians, and for Israel to return to its 1967 borders. Given the people in charge in both territories, that is very, very unlikely.

I Intend To Escape ......................And Come Back

Rasta - I have been writing, critically, about Islamo-Anarchism for years, and will continue to do so. Intellectually I regard the concept as nonsense - it is a bit like trying to be a Catholic Orangeman. But I have seen it done well - the Steampunk Sharia site is at least run by someone with a head on his shoulders - and badly. The tweet I blogged about is an example of it being done badly - the politics of Kevin the Teenager writ large.

(To see the Steampunk Sharia site follow the link below)

http://www.steampunkshariah.info/

On Gaza, I was delighted to see the Head of the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades killed by the IDF. The society he and Hamas are creating in Gaza (and will soon no doubt create in a Palestinian state) is one without basic freedoms.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/30/women-gaza-life-changed

The tragedy is the civilian deaths, in both Gaza and Israel. The best way for that to stop is for Hamas to stop firing rockets at Israeli civilians, and for Israel to return to its 1967 borders. Given the people in charge in both territories, that is very, very unlikely.

romanticanarchist

Journalists that have the guts, not least the integrity to stand outside of the boundaries imposed by the Nato-Israel-UK-US-Gulf States information structure are particularly vulnerable to becoming targets of the killing machine itself. The media, shoulders an important responsibility in terms of its role within the structure, which is to disseminate misinformation in the direction of the general public in order to help deliver a kind of audience of passive consumers who will wholly accept that a two-sided “war” keeps episodically breaking out in the region. To help achieve this, the BBC for example, will routinely present information to its audience without explaining the context of the information. It will perhaps for instance present a Zionist activist as an independent analyst and then allow him/her to speak uninterrupted or unchallenged for several minutes throughout interviews. The strength and scope of the arsenal of weaponry available to the Israeli military will never be discussed and certainly not contrasted with the crude rockets which are actually available to its Palestinian counterparts.

There are 1.6 million people currently being held in a strip of land which is approximately 20 miles long and about 4 miles wide. These people are being held by an Israeli government which is sponsored by a Nato-US-UK killing machine to the tune of three billion US dollars per annum. The Gaza Strip, is not a “war zone” as the nice man from the BBC would have you believe, but a bombing-field, which is overseen by a killing machine that has been in an almost permanent state of bombing for the past two decades.

The question is, as it is always: WHICH SIDE ARE YOU ON?

Seán McGouran

I'm not an anarchist (was, vaguely, at one time) but in what sense is / are Islam and anarchism all that different?
Despite endless media drivel about Muslim 'clerics' Islam (apart from Shia - a distinct, and state-oriented (the state in question being Iran) minority tradition) - Islam is not what Coleridge would have called a 'clerisy'.
A glance at the Quran, and one can set oneself up as an Imam, and get a following.

romanticanarchist

Anarchism does not limit itself simply to the abolition of the state. Anarchism represents the ongoing destruction of all coercive power relationships at both the macro and micro levels. Islam, as with all other forms of religion or mysticism favours the radical devaluation of the material world in place of some higher realm or being. It cannot therefore be compatible with anarchism. Religion has for many thousands of years been the device through which powerful people have taken wealth from the poor in order to give to the rich. Ideology and more subtle forms of mind control are perhaps more pervasive now particularly in western cultures, but the object remains the same.

crack

Its odd that an anarchist thinks that the underlining cause of and issue in latest onslaught on Gaza is "Hamas [] firing rockets at Israeli civilians." One would have to internalize and subscribe to a certain degree to nationalist ideology to rationalize this narrative of events.

And I savor the irony of you mocking MuslimAnarchist for calling people to vote Labor out in by-elections and then write "Given the people in charge in both territories"- as if the issue here, even to a minor degree, is the kind of administrators that run the central committees. Not a very anarchist, or left-wing for that matter, analysis of the state or the history of the "conflict".

Paul Stott

Here's a game for you. Go and be an Anarchist in Israel for six months. Then go and be an Anarchist in Gaza. My guess is we would never see you again from your second visit.

I Intend To Escape ......................And Come Back

Crack - I never said I was an Anarchist.

Here's a game for you. Go and be an Anarchist in Israel for six months. Then go and be an Anarchist in Gaza. My guess is we would never see you again from your second visit.

Internationalist

I looked up this lady's blog.

Don't agree with a lot of it but more thought-provoking than Paul Stott's brand of Zionist-anarchism.

Not difficult.

http://themuslimanarchist.wordpress.com/

Rasta is right. The original post was snide and stupid.

Rasta

@ Paul: are you for fucking real? You are seriously chatting some shit about "the best hope for peace is for Hamas to stop firing rockets at israeli civilians and for israel to return to its 1967 borders" without even glancingly mentioning the fact that (a) the vicious and murderous ethnic cleansing of Palestine (that resulted in a flood of refugees into Gaza, helping to make it the most densely populated strip of land in the world) began in 1947-8 (with its roots in 1917), not in "1967"; (b) the 'rockets'/fireworks from Gaza began in 2000 AD, not 1948 and not 1967, and long after israel had been firing real, state of the art rockets at civilians in Gaza and elsewhere consistently, for ages; (c) israel kills 1000s of Gazan civiliians for every 1 israeli (civilian or not) killed by the resistance factions of Gaza (which include the more "moderate" Fatah, the more "extreme" Islamic Jihad, and the secular, marxist-leninst PFLP, not only Hamas); (d) the facts of near-universal military conscription and the widespread support for the brutal racist occupation by the majority of israel's thoroughly brainwashed and indoctrinated population blurs the lines between 'civilians' and 'military' somewhat..although certainly all children everywhere are always innocent and there is no justification for anyone to target kids for any reason; (e) on almost every occasion, and this one was no different, it was israel who violated ceasefires and truces, not Hamas or any other faction in Gaza, so "stopping firing rockets" has actually been done, on numerous occasions (now being just one), and the result has been not "peace", but more attacks on Gazan civilians (as is happening now with farmers and fishermen under live-fire attack from the IOF, as per the pre-'ceasefire' routine...)... I could go on...in fact, I will, let me just post this before it times out my session..

Rasta

(f) regardless of your faux-concern about oppression of women and others by Jabari and his regime, only a lunatic would suggest that israel assassinated him in order to make Gaza more "free." To judge from several accounts from well-informed sources, they assassinated him because he was about to present the draft of a more permanent truce agreement with israel than previous ones, and the last thing israel wants is a permanent or semi-permanent stop to rocket fire out of Gaza since that takes away one of its main excuses for its constant and vastly disproportionate aggresssion. (g) It is up to the people of Gaza to choose, overthrow and/or create their own political representation, not up to UK-based "terrorism researchers" and pseudo-"anarchists." (h) the freedom to drink a beer or smoke a hookah in public, or to mingle socially with your friends of the opposite sex in public, are indeed important and shouldn't be discounted as trivial, especially when they may provide some of the only respite you may get from being constantly surveilled, starved or rather "put on a diet" as the smirking fascist bastards of the israeli state put it, bombed with experimental weapons of mass torture and destruction, and shot with live ammunition for trying to earn a living as a farmer or fisherman. However I reckon that every single sane person in Gaza, if asked to rank the importance of 'freedoms', would rank "being free to not be constantly surveilled, 'put on a diet', bombed with weapons of mass torture and destruction, and shot with live ammo for trying to earn a living" just that little bit above being free to smoke a hookah in public on the beach with your friends of the opposite sex. It's not that both are not important, it's that there is such a thing as priorities. I dare say that not a single one of the people I've spoken to from Gaza (some of whom are extreeeeemely critical of Hamas btw) would share your "delight" at Jabari's assassination, especially since there is no conceivable way that it was either designed to, or will have the unintended effect of, making Gaza more "free."

Rasta

(i) re your snide little invitation to "go be an anarchist in Gaza"...do you think that nobody has? If I just happen to personally know one anarchist who has been to Gaza, then I'm sure there must be more. Noam Chomsky is quite a famous one, and seems to have emerged from his recent trip to Gaza unscathed. But let's say for argument's sake that it is easier to be an anarchist in 'israel' than in Gaza (as I don't doubt that it is..*slightly* easier that is)...so..fucking..what? This is supposed to be a "point"? I dare say that life among the "happy valley set" of colonial Kenya was considerably more "free" than life as a starving Kikuyu. But the fact that the "freedom" of one was predicated on the oppression, dispossession and attempted extermination of the other surely deserves to be taken into account by anyone calling themselves an "anarchist", unless they're just an "anarchist" of the individualist or right-libertarian variety, who in my view do not deserve the title since not one of those selfish fucks has ever sacrificed their lives or anything else for their supposed 'ideals', whereas many thousands of anarchist-communists and anarcho-syndicalists have. Recommended reading: "The ones who walk away from Omelas" by Ursula K. Le Guin.
@romanticanarchist: who is to say that your interpretation of what Islam means (and I'd bet money you've never read the Quran in full, let alone in arabic) is the only possible interpretation of it? Look, all you fundamentalist anarcho-purists: we want the majority of the world to be anarchists/sympathetic to anarchism, right? Well, face the fact that the majority of the world at the moment does follow some 'religion' or other, with varying degrees of diligency and literal-mindedness, and their only reasons for following these religious traditions are not solely because they have been indoctrinated/threatened with hellfire or social isolation - in many cases they follow them because their values provide some meaning, guidance and solace in their lives. All religions that I know the slightest bit about have both "liberatory" and "oppressive" aspects to them. Instead of insisting that everyone must throw out the baby with the bathwater and embrace the thinking of 19th century anti-religious europeans (mostly) hook line and sinker, why not meet people half way? Many religious people are simply never going to stop being religious but that doesn't mean that they cannot embrace and live by anarchist principles. I know plenty of Muslims who are quite sympathetic to the idea of anarchism when you explain what it means..because it's basically common sense at the end of the day. I know plenty of Muslim women who may wear a hijab or whatever but who have no desire to force anyone else to wear a hijab or whatever. I also know a Muslim-raised anarchist/anarchist-sympathizer from back home who now considers herself to be an atheist, but who still 'practices Islam' in terms of fasting on ramadan, giving alms to the poor, etc. Not everyone fits into a neat little box and surely anarchists of all people should be the first to recognize that.

romanticanarchist

Rasta, I agree with you completely. The process of communicating and engaging with people with the aim of achieving some sort of mutual understanding in terms of what we all want, what we all think and how we all want to live, requires a lot of patience, a lot of humility and a lot of skill. People that hold irrational beliefs, beliefs that have perhaps been cemented over several generations, are unlikely to take much notice of spotty, judgemental anarchists, criticising their lives, advising them about what they ought to be doing and avoiding most, if not all of their concerns about the world. Communication ought to be a reflexive process that helps us to learn from each other.


Larry O'Hara

Is this the same romantic anarchist who uses sinide psychiatric insinuations to character assassinate people? Indeed it is!

What can be learned by communicating with this creature? Nothing of value, I'd venture to suggest

romanticanarchist

Larry, you sound upset. I suspect that you are angry because I made fun of you on another thread, instead of criticising the actual content of the things you had said in your posts. That was very lazy of me. Sorry.

Larry O'Hara

apology accepted: argument I welcome, but after twenty years of incessant vile psychiatric-style abuse, I do react to such.

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